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HH2 hydrogen technology purports to turn any gas-guzzler into a hybrid

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December 2, 2009

HydroLectricPower claims its HH2 system can turn just about any fossil fuel powered vehicl...

HydroLectricPower claims its HH2 system can turn just about any fossil fuel powered vehicle into an eco-friendly hybrid

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When the promoters of the HH2 Hydrogen Generator Clean Air Combustion System made an appearance at last year’s LA Auto Show they attracted their fair share of skepticism. Hardly surprising given their claims of boosting the horsepower, performance, and mileage of existing vehicles through the addition of an aftermarket device that mixes hydrogen and oxygen extracted from water with existing fuel. But the naysayers haven’t discouraged the system’s developers as they are fronting up to the LA Auto Show again this year with even loftier claims thanks to improvements to their system.

California based company, HydroLectricPower, claims its HH2 system can turn just about any fossil fuel (petrol, diesel or compressed natural gas) powered vehicle into an eco-friendly hybrid with the installation of a book-sized device. This device apparently uses excess energy from the vehicle’s 12 Volt battery to extract hydrogen and oxygen from distilled water, which are then blended with the existing fuel source to enhance fuel combustion inside the engine combustion chambers.

The company says that due to the high instant burn temperature of the Hydrogen (Octane 130), the system is able to completely incinerate most fuel toxins, poisons and particulate matter, resulting in a clean, warm, moist air exhaust discharge. And because the fuel is completely burned, the system allows the vehicle to achieve improved fuel economy and performance.

HydroLectricPower are at pains to point out that its system is not an HHO system, which some (including HydroLectricPower) liken to carrying a bomb around in your trunk. HydroLectricPower claim its HH2 system is safer because the hydrogen and oxygen gases go into the vehicle air intake system separately from each other, and never can combine to become water or unstable HHO.

HHO systems have also been exposed as a scam with that pesky first law of thermodynamics getting in the way. The law states that the energy generated by recombining hydrogen and oxygen through combustion can never exceed the amount of energy it took to separate them. Add to that the various losses involved in the generation of electricity and HHO systems that produce hydrogen and oxygen gases from water using electrolysis will actually result in less energy being recovered from burning the hydrogen than it took to create it.

With the dodgy record of HHO systems it’s not surprising that most are a little wary of HydroLectricPower’s claims. After all, if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is – and the HH2 system definitely sounds too good to be true. The lack of independent test results also doesn’t help matters any, but the company has posted the results of a number of dyno tests, emissions slips, and mileage records on its website.

HH2 Systems are available for a range of vehicles, with prices starting at US$1,399 for a 4-cylinder unit. Installation will generally cost an extra $500 on top of that. And, if you’re in LA, you can drop by the HydroLectricPower stand at the LA Auto Show running until December 13 and get the spiel straight from the horse’s mouth.

About the Author
Darren Quick Darren's love of technology started in primary school with a Nintendo Game & Watch Donkey Kong (still functioning) and a Commodore VIC 20 computer (not still functioning). In high school he upgraded to a 286 PC, and he's been following Moore's law ever since. This love of technology continued through a number of university courses and crappy jobs until 2008, when his interests found a home at Gizmag.   All articles by Darren Quick
13 Comments

perhaps with regenerative braking and heat to electricity transfer could help with the HH2 system. but my question is, will there be enough water on board to fully power(?)

the HH2 system without additional water storage tanks?

and will the HH2 split enough hydrogen and oxygen gas fast enough to supply the engine all on its own?

by the way, how much hydrogen and oxygen gas are in 1 liter of distilled water?

1 liter=2.11...pints(US)=0.26...gallons(US)

bio-power jeff
3rd December, 2009 @ 12:12 am PST

Not to be a stickler for detail but I believe the point of HHO / HOH systems are that fractional amount of hydrogen gas acts as a combustion aid, burning more of the fuel present. No one has ever said it produces more energy than you put in, this is over-unity.

Comparing the resultant energy of the gas alongside the required energy to produce the gas fundamentally misses the point. The power gain is from the accelerant effect on the overall fuel usage.

Thus would you agree the statement "HHO systems have also been exposed as a scam with that pesky first law of thermodynamics getting in the way." may be a little short-sighted or even mis-leading?

Further from what I understand HHO / HOH gas is a combustion aid and works with all fossil based fuels, so again the comparative claim of HH2 over other HHO / HOH systems could be considered more marketing than unique feature.

http://www.hohcells.com has a LOT of information on this if anyone wants to see more

Philip Bateman
3rd December, 2009 @ 02:35 am PST

I don't think the claim is to get more energy out than in, the claim is that adding a little H2 and O2 to the existing combustion makes it burn hotter and faster, extracting more energy from the fuel and reducing emissions.

A 12 volt battery cannot crack H2O that quickly so the volume of water needed is low. I suppose it could always capture water from the exhaust and re-crack it, although that would be a bigger, more expensive solution and would require regular cleaning of the other junk it would collect.

But I am sceptical if they do not have independent lab verification of their claims, still a nice idea in theory.

Dean Randle
3rd December, 2009 @ 06:51 am PST

As we have progressed from carburetors to injectors to direct injection the results of aiding the combustion of the fuel mixture becomes less effective. I have yet to see a demonstration vehicle that did not involve some 1980's carbureted junk heap. Also, poor form gizmag for invoking the first law of thermodynamics to 'bust' the myth.

The real questions are whether there is enough unburnt fuel in modern cars to make the added hydrogen and oxygen useful? Can modern cars and their computers handle in essence a vacuum leak? Would unintended acceleration be a problem?

CreativeApex
3rd December, 2009 @ 08:18 am PST

i seem to have made an error in my question.

what i meant to ask was can the system split hydrogen and oxygen gas fast enough to be the internal combustion engine's sole provider of air used when burning fuels?

as i understand a normal car burns normal air(Nitrogen,argon,oxygen,co2...)

which produces NOx and other pollutents when burned in a normal engine.

bio-power jeff
3rd December, 2009 @ 11:19 pm PST

I think that the following sould be considered:

1. Validation of the claims

2. Equipment and installation costs

3. Effect on car or motor warrentees

4. Possible effects of temperature change on the equipment (very hot vs icy weather) and the overall efficiency of the system as compared to its functioning on liquid fuel alone.

5. Can one system do all? Will the improvement in efficiency be the same for motors requiring different amounts of fuel if the amount of gas introduced is the same? Varying amounts of fuel for the same amount of introduced gas may result in varying levels of efficiency. There should be a graphic representation presented that shows increased efficiency/power of the motor vs the amounts of gas introduced. The system being sold may only work well with relatively small motors but not with larger ones. More systematic studies should be presented.

If the method of more complete combustion of fuels is enhanced by the introduction of hydrogen, then a more careful analysis should be presented. What specific volumes of hydrogen at varying temperatures would work best with different types of fuel to promote the most efficient combustion.

adrianakau2aol.com

Adrian Akau
4th December, 2009 @ 08:59 am PST

Snake. Oil.

The hypermiling community has repeatedly asked these people to submit a system for scientific testing.

For some reason they just don't want an unbiased person to do a public test.

go to http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums and search on snake oil.

jvnn
4th December, 2009 @ 10:44 am PST

In my studies, the creation of the hydrogen takes more energy than it provides. Besides, there is no "excess" in the 12v battery, rather it is stored for the next time your turn the car on! I read a great article "HHO or HHype?" http://economicefficiency.blogspot.com/2008/07/hho-or-hhype.html and its link to a companion piece, spell out how these hydrogen claims are misleading at best and fraudulent at worst.

Perhaps we should be focused on flywheels or hydraulics as stores of energy to suppliment our vehicles instead of hydrogen or chemical batteries? http://economicefficiency.blogspot.com/2009/10/more-efficient-hybrid.html

gormanwvzb
4th December, 2009 @ 12:24 pm PST

Didn't Mythbusters do an episode on gas mileage claims and they completly busted Hydrogen?

http://mythbustersresults.com/episode53

Check out the section "You can 'stick it to The Man' and get cheap uber-fuel efficiency with a hydrogen fuel cell"

You can read that yes, they were able to get a car to start on Hydrogen, but it wasn't very good...

ed

Ed
4th December, 2009 @ 01:27 pm PST

We manufacture a very efficient HHO cell series- what we call a Hybrid cell. It is NOT dangerous because you do not store anything- it is merely hydrogen on demand. The articles claims that HHo doesn't work, yet the same amount of energy is used in the HH2 systems- this is nonsense.

First of all, HHO, Oxyhydrogen,Hydroxy, or the rest of the terms given to electrolyzed molecules of water NOT separated by a membrane, is only used as a catalyst, not a supplanter of fuel. It burns 10 times quicker than gasoline and so is able to extract more energy out in the same 16 degrees of piston travel, before it is exhausted out the tailpipe. We recently had a dual system hooked to our project car and you could stick your nose up against the tailpipe- it was fresh smelling, like Ozone.

Second of all, there are many of us that are in the process of external and independent testing and verification.

Lastly, Most of the poorly researched scam articles are written by those who have either NOT tested a system or have tried to install really BADLY designed systems, and then when they didn't get it to work started madly claiming all of them were a scam.

Our systems work, and are some of the best ones out there. Do they replace gas? NO! But they do result in an average increase of 20-40% which can quickly add up, especially overseas where gas is almost $2.00 a liter ($7.00 a gallon).

One of our customers just wrote us that he put our new Hybrid cell in his '92 Ford Explorer with a 4.0 liter engine and 150,000 miles on it. He went from 17 mpg to 23.8mpg, fully a 40% increase. Another customer in Dublin Ireland went from 300 miles a tank to over 420 miles a tank (his words, not mine).

If you'd like more info- get my free 7 day course on becoming an expert here: http://www.hhokitsdirect.com you can email from there and I will answer your questions...

Thanks, Bob

Facebook User
5th December, 2009 @ 07:38 am PST

With the efficiency of the internal combustion engine at 20-25% there is great room for improvement.

This is not about making energy "out of thin air" but about improving the combustion process to achieve a net gain.

I wish them success.

PrometheusGoneWild.com
5th December, 2009 @ 05:20 pm PST

It would be very easy for Dennis or Bob to prove tha their scam is not a scam by simply hooking up their "Hydrogen generator" to a pull start generator, replacing the fuel system with a "HHO generator" and then running the generator without petrol.

If the system can actually produce a net energy gain then you should be able to pull start it and it will run for ever off its condensed exhaust emissions (water).

If not, then there is not battery on a pull start gen set and if the fuel system is removed then the demonstrator will simply get some exercise trying to pull start a lie.

Drew__1
6th December, 2009 @ 04:15 pm PST

good comment Drew,,,,easy to prove or disprove this way

rob yates
8th December, 2009 @ 05:18 pm PST
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